Some Points.

[Derry Drummer]

McCann has mentioned a few things. 

At 11.59pm the deal was done.  For a club record. We couldn't really say no. 

Scott Allan got his agent to text McCann and wanted to leave. Why would we want him here?

Scott Bain was never playing for us again and we managed to get rid of him and get a fee. Is that not good business? We have recalled a player to loan him out again? So how can we call Celtic for doing it with Allan?

McCann wanted Murray.  For a while.  Not a panic loan and Murray himself is baffled why he has been loaned out. He will be wanted to prove Lennon made a mistake.  Only good for us. 

The board didn't do bad here. They also got Low and Vincent out the door. Williams is gone too. 2 promising youths on and a decent replacement keeper?

Have a think back to Stephen Hughes, yon klock c**t and umpteen other rubbish loans in January and bad mistakes. 

Take a breath people.  

[barkblue]

4 minutes ago, Derry Drummer said:

McCann has mentioned a few things. 

At 11.59pm the deal was done.  For a club record. We couldn't really say no. 

Scott Allan got his agent to text McCann and wanted to leave. Why would we want him here?

Scott Bain was never playing for us again and we managed to get rid of him and get a fee. Is that not good business? We have recalled a player to loan him out again? So how can we call Celtic for doing it with Allan?

McCann wanted Murray.  For a while.  Not a panic loan and Murray himself is baffled why he has been loaned out. He will be wanted to prove Lennon made a mistake.  Only good for us. 

The board didn't do bad here. They also got Low and Vincent out the door. Williams is gone too. 2 promising youths on and a decent replacement keeper?

Have a think back to Stephen Hughes, yon klock c**t and umpteen other rubbish loans in January and bad mistakes. 

Take a breath people.  

Don't knock the klok. 

[Boba Fett]

15 minutes ago, Derry Drummer said:

McCann has mentioned a few things. 

At 11.59pm the deal was done.  For a club record. We couldn't really say no. 

Scott Allan got his agent to text McCann and wanted to leave. Why would we want him here?

Scott Bain was never playing for us again and we managed to get rid of him and get a fee. Is that not good business? We have recalled a player to loan him out again? So how can we call Celtic for doing it with Allan?

McCann wanted Murray.  For a while.  Not a panic loan and Murray himself is baffled why he has been loaned out. He will be wanted to prove Lennon made a mistake.  Only good for us. 

The board didn't do bad here. They also got Low and Vincent out the door. Williams is gone too. 2 promising youths on and a decent replacement keeper?

Have a think back to Stephen Hughes, yon klock c**t and umpteen other rubbish loans in January and bad mistakes. 

Take a breath people.  

Wise words mate

[Boba Fett]

Another point to think about though...

Thats us up to about £2.5m In player sales over the last 18 months.

Conscious that some of it will be due out elsewhere but it’s high time we seen some of that being reinvested into the squad with bringing in a really high quality player or two for this level.

Constant pay off’s, a bloated squad and still paying wage %’s on loans is sucking out far too much £££

I think it’s reasonable to assume we’ll be doing the same with the likes of Moussa, Haber & Vincent in the not too distant future as well.

McCanns signings have been good (in the main) - we’ve got a little bit of money in and although the directors will be anxious to recoup some of the losses they’ve plugged, spending it wisely on players of the right age and talent who are much more likely to propel us up the league will bring them and the club a better return in the future.

[barkblue]

5 minutes ago, Boba Fett said:

Another point to think about though...

Thats us up to about £2.5m In player sales over the last 18 months.

Conscious that some of it will be due out elsewhere but it’s high time we seen some of that being reinvested into the squad with bringing in a really high quality player or two for this level.

Constant pay off’s, a bloated squad and still paying wage %’s on loans is sucking out far too much £££

I think it’s reasonable to assume we’ll be doing the same with the likes of Moussa, Haber & Vincent in the not too distant future as well.

McCanns signings have been good (in the main) - we’ve got a little bit of money in and although the directors will be anxious to recoup some of the losses they’ve plugged, spending it wisely on players of the right age and talent who are much more likely to propel us up the league will bring them and the club a better return in the future.

To be fair mate, we don't know what sort of investment has taken place in terms of signing on fees etc for guys like Kamara and Hendry, or Deacon. How much were we paying of Allan's wages etc etc.

I'm not sure we'll ever be paying big fees (although we have paid fees since the Yanks came in). I think the idea behind the reinvestment is to attract good players and good prospects and compete maybe slightly above our station in that way. 

It feels to me like guys like Low, Williams, Vincent, Hendry, Kamara, Deacon, and so on are meant to be that upgrade, it just hasn't always worked out like that in the reality.

[Boba Fett]

7 minutes ago, barkblue said:

To be fair mate, we don't know what sort of investment has taken place in terms of signing on fees etc for guys like Kamara and Hendry, or Deacon. How much were we paying of Allan's wages etc etc.

I'm not sure we'll ever be paying big fees (although we have paid fees since the Yanks came in). I think the idea behind the reinvestment is to attract good players and good prospects and compete maybe slightly above our station in that way. 

It feels to me like guys like Low, Williams, Vincent, Hendry, Kamara, Deacon, and so on are meant to be that upgrade, it just hasn't always worked out like that in the reality.

I’m not just referring to going out and paying a fee for a player mate.. A higher wage offering that will help us compete for a quality player can be just as effective.

Dont get me wrong, I’m all for developing talent and unearthing gems from a lower level / obscure league but if we really do want to get away from just surviving in this league, then we’re going to need to improve our player identification and go after better players.

We’ll not get to where we want to be if we continue to bring in the likes of Moussa, Haber and Elbak2e. 

[barkblue]

3 minutes ago, Boba Fett said:

I’m not just referring to going out and paying a fee for a player mate.. A higher wage offering that will help us compete for a quality player can be just as effective.

Dont get me wrong, I’m all for developing talent and unearthing gems from a lower level / obscure league but if we really do want to get away from just surviving in this league, then we’re going to need to improve our player identification and go after better players.

We’ll not get to where we want to be if we continue to bring in the likes of Moussa, Haber and Elbak2e. 

The sad thing is I think these guys are the higher wage bill these days.

Over and above that, if we're making an annual loss on the lesser wages then how sustainable is it to plug that gap and still then pay more? 

All guess work. You might be right.

[BCram]

That question of where do we want to be, is very rarely asked. Seems to me the only yardstick we use is the size of our support, so perhaps 5th is the answer. That should also imply that we regularly reach the quarter finals of both cup competitions. 

Edited 3 February 2018 by BCram

[Rusty Dee]

52 minutes ago, Derry Drummer said:

McCann has mentioned a few things. 

At 11.59pm the deal was done.  For a club record. We couldn't really say no. 

Scott Allan got his agent to text McCann and wanted to leave. Why would we want him here?

Scott Bain was never playing for us again and we managed to get rid of him and get a fee. Is that not good business? We have recalled a player to loan him out again? So how can we call Celtic for doing it with Allan?

McCann wanted Murray.  For a while.  Not a panic loan and Murray himself is baffled why he has been loaned out. He will be wanted to prove Lennon made a mistake.  Only good for us. 

The board didn't do bad here. They also got Low and Vincent out the door. Williams is gone too. 2 promising youths on and a decent replacement keeper?

Have a think back to Stephen Hughes, yon klock c**t and umpteen other rubbish loans in January and bad mistakes. 

Take a breath people.  

Totally agree DD. I think our board did very well under the circumstances they were faced with.  NM  is correct in his view point of Celtic. They just can't play a fair and decent game if they tired. Wait to the last minute to pay the price we told them weeks ago. That way they know we can't sign our preferred options  which may weaken us for the next time we play them. Total pr**ks 

[8utters]

9 hours ago, Derry Drummer said:

McCann has mentioned a few things. 

At 11.59pm the deal was done.  For a club record. We couldn't really say no. 

Scott Allan got his agent to text McCann and wanted to leave. Why would we want him here?

Scott Bain was never playing for us again and we managed to get rid of him and get a fee. Is that not good business? We have recalled a player to loan him out again? So how can we call Celtic for doing it with Allan?

McCann wanted Murray.  For a while.  Not a panic loan and Murray himself is baffled why he has been loaned out. He will be wanted to prove Lennon made a mistake.  Only good for us. 

The board didn't do bad here. They also got Low and Vincent out the door. Williams is gone too. 2 promising youths on and a decent replacement keeper?

Have a think back to Stephen Hughes, yon klock c**t and umpteen other rubbish loans in January and bad mistakes. 

Take a breath people.  

I feel a lot better now.

[scooter99]

9 hours ago, Rusty Dee said:

Totally agree DD. I think our board did very well under the circumstances they were faced with.  NM  is correct in his view point of Celtic. They just can't play a fair and decent game if they tired. Wait to the last minute to pay the price we told them weeks ago. That way they know we can't sign our preferred options  which may weaken us for the next time we play them. Total pr**ks 

I don't think Celtic really worry about the team we've got as we haven't beaten them in years. It's more likely the valuation we put on JH was ticking in their throats and they just could't bring themselves to pay it until 11.59. They see us aa a mickey mouse club and until we are in a position to be able to knock back offers fro players, that won't change.

[Billy Pirie]

9 hours ago, BCram said:

That question of where do we want to be, is very rarely asked. Seems to me the only yardstick we use is the size of our support, so perhaps 5th is the answer. That should also imply that we regularly reach the quarter finals of both cup competitions. 

Very sensible and realistic post fella. I started going to Dens regularly from 1967 when my auld man or my Grandad would take me. Back then we were considered one of the bigger clubs in Scotland and games against the OF would see anything between 18-25,000 inside Dens. Gates of circa 15K were common for UEFA/Scottish cup games. In the 10 years from 1967 I saw us in 2 League Cup finals and countless QF and semi finals. We had some tremendous players and the squad of players in the early 70s undoubtedly underachieved. Where did we finish up in the league during this period? My memory is fading but anything between 5th and 9th and that position got us relegated in 76 on goal difference. My point (eventually) is whilst I would love to see us challenging for Europe each year it may take a few years yet before we're in that position. With better players and bigger crowds in the past we often struggled to reach these levels. Dwindling gates and inconsistent performances on the park means it will be a battle to achieve this. Maybe the new stadium will be the catalyst

Edited 3 February 2018 by Billy Pirie