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Harold Finch

Dundee Managers

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In the last 12 years we have had Alex Rae, Jocky, Chisholm, Barry Smith, John Brown, Hartley and now McCann

From the list above you can see that we have mostly went down the ex player route with Hartley being the exception (Rae was initially player/manager), we have tried  "ex old firm" with Alex Rae "old school" with Jocky and Bomber  "doing well in the lower leagues" with Chisholm "promote from within" with Barry Smith  and "modern game manager" with Hartley and now a total punt with McCann

We really have tried different types of managers over the last few years to get us up and keep us up

A special mention must go to Barry Smith for the Deefiant Season and the Club 12 season, it's good to see him quietly going about his business at Raith

 

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4 hours ago, Harold Finch said:

In the last 12 years we have had Alex Rae, Jocky, Chisholm, Barry Smith, John Brown, Hartley and now McCann

From the list above you can see that we have mostly went down the ex player route with Hartley being the exception (Rae was initially player/manager), we have tried  "ex old firm" with Alex Rae "old school" with Jocky and Bomber  "doing well in the lower leagues" with Chisholm "promote from within" with Barry Smith  and "modern game manager" with Hartley and now a total punt with McCann

We really have tried different types of managers over the last few years to get us up and keep us up

A special mention must go to Barry Smith for the Deefiant Season and the Club 12 season, it's good to see him quietly going about his business at Raith

 

Frighteningly Jocky would probably be most people's pick of the bunch (Barry's Deefiant season aside).

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Jocky for me.  Griffiths and GGH at the height of his superpowers.  Shame it went off the rails.  Spectacularly it has to be said.

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2 hours ago, WeighorstsWang said:

Alex Rae for me. Thoroughly enjoyed that season personally (Partick away aside). 

Was on the Bobby Cox for the away games that season...... Total carnage 

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11 minutes ago, ThelegendthatisBeto said:

Was on the Bobby Cox for the away games that season...... Total carnage 

;) 

"you've lost that lovin' feelin'"..

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13 hours ago, WeighorstsWang said:

Alex Rae for me. Thoroughly enjoyed that season personally (Partick away aside). 

Yea i liked Alex Rae - in fairness to Rae we lost out on Div 1 to a talented and hard Harmilton side , Rae got it wrong following season and the correct decision was made , Rae done 2 baffling decisions tho in his time at Dundee in loaning out Curier to a Hamilton (which he scored in spl) and let Lyle sign for a direct rival whilst still playing for us.

My fav season was for excitment was Ivano`s first season and season with most pride was Deefiant season.

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Have been trying to think of the success that managers have had after we got rid. Can't think of any significant or outstanding careers for those who we moved on. Seems that Duffy is still well respected and might do well if he was given a chance in the SPFL. NM might just be the one we start off.

Edited by BCram
Bring in NM to stick to topic.

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It's interesting to note that, since JD took off for Hibs in 1996, we've had eleven managerial appointments and ten managers (Jocky's been in the hotseat twice).

The result's been a sacking for the manager every time.

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15 hours ago, CC33 said:

Yea i liked Alex Rae - in fairness to Rae we lost out on Div 1 to a talented and hard Harmilton side , Rae got it wrong following season and the correct decision was made , Rae done 2 baffling decisions tho in his time at Dundee in loaning out Curier to a Hamilton (which he scored in spl) and let Lyle sign for a direct rival whilst still playing for us.

My fav season was for excitment was Ivano`s first season and season with most pride was Deefiant season.

Davie Farrell's book alludes to the financial shambles that the club was suffering from at the time and a lot of the player movement was not necessarily of their choosing. 

I thought the pair would do well at St Mirren, but that got blown out of the water pretty quickly for me.

From that list, Barry Smith was the one that got sacked that I thought we got thoroughly wrong. 

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10 hours ago, barkblue said:

Davie Farrell's book alludes to the financial shambles that the club was suffering from at the time and a lot of the player movement was not necessarily of their choosing. 

I thought the pair would do well at St Mirren, but that got blown out of the water pretty quickly for me.

From that list, Barry Smith was the one that got sacked that I thought we got thoroughly wrong. 

I thought they`d do well at St Mirren too.
That was a good side we had in Rae`s first season - imo that team then would beat this team now and I think that's just an example of how standards have dropped

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The only appointment that has really worked was Hartley. He was the obvious outstanding candidate at the time and probably the only appointment that every fan was fully behind out of that lot. The Barry Smith appointment was obviously different given the exceptional circumstances.

Hartley for me is the only one that has turned out to be a really good appointment IMO. He's the only one that has brought us genuine success and was in charge for all the memorable games during that 12 year period (deefiant season aside).

Smith probably did deserve another crack at the first division with us instead of being sacked. That said I was in favour of him being sacked at the time. John Brown was able to get a reaction from the players and if he'd been appointed slightly earlier we might have stayed up.  I don't think Smith has done anything since being sacked to suggest we made the wrong decision.

 

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Hartley came to Dundee as a successful manager having won successive promotions with Alloa. How many other Dundee managers had success before coming to Dens? None that I can think of.

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Hartley should have left for Cardiff when he had the chance, it's amazing how quickly his stock has fallen. It's hard to see where he goes from a mid championship Falkirk, it's interesting to see players like Rory Loy and Alex Harris still letting him down (I wont include David Mitchell as he's pretty much a sub)

I liked Hartley when he was at Dens, he had a bit of dig about him and he signed a few quality players in amongst the many that didn't work out. He certainly helped improve us as a club

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Is Loy getting a game now?

As you said, Harold, Hartley definitely should have went if the offer was ever really there. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and it was pretty deplorable how he was chased out of the club.

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Football management is brutal. Killie have outperformed Celtic since December and yet Steve Clarke only came up the road because no-one would employ him.

If it's true that Cardiff made an offer then that was his moment to have a go at a higher level. Working for Vincent Tan though? What a nightmare. Tan once asked why the Cardiff keeper had such a poor goalscoring rate and he said he wanted to sign players with an 8 in their date of birth.

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Looking across the road it's amazing that Jim McLean managed more games for United than all his replacements combined until McKinnon arrived last year.........and has since been pumped :D

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2 minutes ago, Cobra said:

Football management is brutal. Killie have outperformed Celtic since December and yet Steve Clarke only came up the road because no-one would employ him.

If it's true that Cardiff made an offer then that was his moment to have a go at a higher level. Working for Vincent Tan though? What a nightmare. Tan once asked why the Cardiff keeper had such a poor goalscoring rate and he said he wanted to sign players with an 8 in their date of birth.

Sounds nearly as bad as Ron Dixon :D

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