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9 hours ago, Islaydarkblue said:

I am saying no more. 

You should have joined DFCSS prior to the meeting and you could have heard everything that was discussed for yourself.

I never moved to Islay but it doesn't stop you spouting all manner of sh**e no one wants to know about what happens there.

Pathetic. 

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5 minutes ago, Dayster said:

Should have added that FPS suggestion was that any money from the sale of shares was then used by the society as part of DFC in the community 🤯

Not good. FPS are not interested in their own fans (customers) so they should not be dictating to DFCSS that any money raised from a potential share sale is used to effectively raise FPS' profile in the community.

For the record I have serious concerns about how certain DFCSS board members define 'the community'. For me it is clear that the community is the 'wider DFC community' i.e. anyone with a connection to DFC, at least one board member insists it's basically anyone in Dundee or the surrounding area and that would include our near neighbours.

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21 minutes ago, Dayster said:

There was no secrecy to the meeting at all, if Islay doesn’t want to share details then that his call 🤷‍♂️

 

AGM itself was just usual sort of business 

The Q&A was completely focused on share issue - there will be a clarification email out in the coming days

 

my takeaways -

consultation was a incorrect as it states FPS desire is for 75%+ , it’s not its to amend the entrenched rights ( as they have no desire to purchase dfcss ordinary shares

- the entrenched rights have already been broken ie level of borrowing, but the only recourse society has is legal which is a road they would be unlikely to go down

-A share holders agreement may give stronger rights but its a shareholder agreement, if the shares are shifted then it’s no longer valid - worry over long term protection 

-suggestion was that the veto need relaxed for funding of camperdown development - I don’t buy it, the club aren’t part of development that’s dark blue holdings so our rights have no bearing. Club just need to ask Society consent for stadium move that would be granted

General feel was that we are being asked to decide something without any detail or a firm proposal. FPS need to layout there long term plans and what the seek to do with change of rights (to all fans)

concensus was that there was no value in selling the A shares

Cheers mate.

This was exactly how I read the situation prior to the meeting as well. Not looking good.

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9 hours ago, Islaydarkblue said:

It was announced at the meeting that all DFCSS members will receive an email in due course. No doubt some poster who is a member of DFCSS will post details of the email on this forum but it will not be me.

Get a grip, Islay..

Perpetuating the myth of a “secret society” right there. 

Pathetic.

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37 minutes ago, Boba Fett said:

Get a grip, Islay..

Perpetuating the myth of a “secret society” right there. 

Pathetic.

I’m still convinced this is a wind up and he’s another poster at the capers 😂

surely.......😬

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58 minutes ago, Dayster said:

Should have added that FPS suggestion was that any money from the sale of shares was then used by the society as part of DFC in the community 🤯

🤣 No doubt!

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10 hours ago, Islaydarkblue said:

It was announced at the meeting that all DFCSS members will receive an email in due course. No doubt some poster who is a member of DFCSS will post details of the email on this forum but it will not be me.

 

2081fe55-7b36-44ab-9056-4f2e479018fd.jpg

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1 hour ago, Dayster said:

Should have added that FPS suggestion was that any money from the sale of shares was then used by the society as part of DFC in the community 🤯

That's good of them.

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15 minutes ago, Offshoredee said:

I’m still convinced this is a wind up and he’s another poster at the capers 😂

surely.......😬

You're treading a dangerous path if you don't believe that Islay is real, believe me he is most definitely real mate.

Take care out there.😱

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1 hour ago, Dayster said:

There was no secrecy to the meeting at all, if Islay doesn’t want to share details then that his call 🤷‍♂️

 

AGM itself was just usual sort of business 

The Q&A was completely focused on share issue - there will be a clarification email out in the coming days

 

my takeaways -

consultation was a incorrect as it states FPS desire is for 75%+ , it’s not its to amend the entrenched rights ( as they have no desire to purchase dfcss ordinary shares

- the entrenched rights have already been broken ie level of borrowing, but the only recourse society has is legal which is a road they would be unlikely to go down

-A share holders agreement may give stronger rights but its a shareholder agreement, if the shares are shifted then it’s no longer valid - worry over long term protection 

-suggestion was that the veto need relaxed for funding of camperdown development - I don’t buy it, the club aren’t part of development that’s dark blue holdings so our rights have no bearing. Club just need to ask Society consent for stadium move that would be granted

General feel was that we are being asked to decide something without any detail or a firm proposal. FPS need to layout there long term plans and what the seek to do with change of rights (to all fans)

concensus was that there was no value in selling the A shares

Cheers, Dayster.

I would be quite surprised though if there is stadium funding given over without financial commitments to Dark Blue Holdings guaranteed - i.e. a rent agreement. I don't think the funders would be very happy if their agreement was legally vulnerable and could he struck down by our own supporters society - it seems to be like a pretty huge issue. No one is going to pay for a facility to be built unless they've got some guarantees in writing.

I can't really see anything else as the big motivator tbh. They obviously would like as much power as possible etc but I just can't see this project going ahead if there are complex financial oversight conditions attached.

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1 minute ago, Harry94 said:

Cheers, Dayster.

I would be quite surprised though if there is stadium funding given over without financial commitments to Dark Blue Holdings guaranteed - i.e. a rent agreement. I don't think the funders would be very happy if their agreement was legally vulnerable and could he struck down by our own supporters society - it seems to be like a pretty huge issue. No one is going to pay for a facility to be built unless they've got some guarantees in writing.

I can't really see anything else as the big motivator tbh. They obviously would like as much power as possible etc but I just can't see this project going ahead if there are complex financial oversight conditions attached.

If you mean DFC signing a rental agreement with DBH then i do not see any issue with that and the club would just have to seek consent from the Society - so the veto on moving stadium wouldn't be exercised

 

What was suggested yesterday was that they are struggling to raise the funds from 3rd parties to build the stadium because of the DFCSS entrenched rights - this i can't agree on as the entrenched rights have no bearing on DBH activities

The problem at the moment is everything is based on conjecture and guesswork because FPS haven't (won't?) come out and give a plan as to how the propose it will all work

As someone pointed out in the meeting yesterday the 'entrenched rights' are not to protect the club from FPS but from any future owner - FPS intention maybe perfectly honest, and if the detail comes we should work with them on it but the rights should be giving up for short term thinking

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7 minutes ago, Dayster said:

If you mean DFC signing a rental agreement with DBH then i do not see any issue with that and the club would just have to seek consent from the Society - so the veto on moving stadium wouldn't be exercised

 

What was suggested yesterday was that they are struggling to raise the funds from 3rd parties to build the stadium because of the DFCSS entrenched rights - this i can't agree on as the entrenched rights have no bearing on DBH activities

The problem at the moment is everything is based on conjecture and guesswork because FPS haven't (won't?) come out and give a plan as to how the propose it will all work

As someone pointed out in the meeting yesterday the 'entrenched rights' are not to protect the club from FPS but from any future owner - FPS intention maybe perfectly honest, and if the detail comes we should work with them on it but the rights should be giving up for short term thinking

Not saying the second part isn't maybe a problem but I'm not so sure it'd be a simple thing with consent. I don't know what it's like in property but whenever I've been involved in funding stuff - everything is pretty much always hush hush, partners don't want to publicise how much money they put into things. If it's DFCSS who have to approve it, it would mean that it'd make things public.

But yeah you're completely right, we're all just speculating so maybe wasting our breath!

I emailed Tim Keyes at the start of this and got a civil response that did say the club would make a statement on it at some point in time but wouldn't be more specific.

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Is it just me or could Nelms not have attended yesterday and spelled the whole lot out? Show face and take the questions. There appears to be little F2F meetings, or the fans d9nt hear about them.

The last thing we need is a stand off and bitterness creeps in. Surely we all want the same thing. A shiny new stadium amd a top league team on the park?

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6 minutes ago, Billy Campbell's Ghost said:

Is it just me or could Nelms not have attended yesterday and spelled the whole lot out? Show face and take the questions. There appears to be little F2F meetings, or the fans d9nt hear about them.

The last thing we need is a stand off and bitterness creeps in. Surely we all want the same thing. A shiny new stadium amd a top league team on the park?

He isn’t a member of the trust so he couldn’t go...

however your point is totally valid and the club should be looking to have an open meeting with all fans to explain plans and flush away rumours 

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2 hours ago, GregTeamDee said:

This kind of attitude is why fans owned will never work for us, ever. Too many people, with a 'blazer/childish' attitude, 'your not part of the group so I'm not telling you'. When will people realise, we are ALL Dundee fans, whether you live in Dundee, London, New York, Sydney, Wick, wherever! We are all Dundee fans, no one is more important or less important. If you are part of DSA or DFCSS, it doesn't matter one little bit.  We have all equally saved our club twice, we have all put money into the club through various means, writing cheques to keep us going, going to home matches (ST or PATG), being a member or non member of one group, attending club events etc... 

I'm glad we never voted to keep us fans owned,  it was never working, we were a laughing stock of a club. Now we are far more professional, yes results are crap this season, but at least we are in the premiership and able to back our manager with funds each season, far better youth development too. Of course mistakes have been made, but there has been far more positives under FPS.

And due to this kind of attitude, I will not renew my membership of DFCSS and I can see why numbers are so low. (I know Islay, isn't speaking on behalf of DFCSS, but why the secrecy of the meeting). 

So you won’t join the society to protect the rights that you correctly pointed out that ALL fans earned because your perceived attitude of one person who isn’t prepared to post an account of what was said at a meeting? Right then 🤷‍♂️🙄

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2 minutes ago, Dayster said:

So you won’t join the society to protect the rights that you correctly pointed out that ALL fans earned because your perceived attitude of one person who isn’t prepared to post an account of what was said at a meeting? Right then 🤷‍♂️🙄

Ross, why are the numbers so low for DFCSS? 

Personally I think there needs to be a massive overhaul in the way DFCSS operate, from their engagement with the fans to the club, and the club to DFCSS. Something has happened that has result in a massive drop in numbers. The papers reported that the membership is around 400, I was shocked that it was so low.  DFCSS can have a role to play in the club, but I feel its lost its way for a while. 

I've never was or have been a fan of complete fan ownership but I do think my view has been tarnished by the way our society acted in the past. Since last week, I haven't heard of anything the society has done or is doing for the community or the club, in my view it's lost its way. 

We will never agree on everything :)

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2 minutes ago, GregTeamDee said:

Ross, why are the numbers so low for DFCSS? 

Personally I think there needs to be a massive overhaul in the way DFCSS operate, from their engagement with the fans to the club, and the club to DFCSS. Something has happened that has result in a massive drop in numbers. The papers reported that the membership is around 400, I was shocked that it was so low.  DFCSS can have a role to play in the club, but I feel its lost its way for a while. 

I've never was or have been a fan of complete fan ownership but I do think my view has been tarnished by the way our society acted in the past. Since last week, I haven't heard of anything the society has done or is doing for the community or the club, in my view it's lost its way. 

We will never agree on everything

Society is struggling because FPS want it that way and apathy is rife amongst the support.

Society can only keep suggesting ideas to the club as to how they can help but if the club aren’t willing to listen then they are stuck.

Securing the safe guards for the fans is the society’s legacy.. and one worth protecting 

FYI society membership is around 130 now... luckily those 130 still own +20% of club and have the entrenched rights as protections.

society membership will grow when the sh*t next hits the fan, same as always 👍

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11 hours ago, Billy Campbell's Ghost said:

I am a member of DfCSS and could not travel, or to be honest could not be arsed, but what went on FFS?

Hi BCG,

i am very surprised that you could not be arsed as there were members who live in your neck of the woods who took the trouble to attend yesterday’s AGM. 

The discussion was mostly about the A shares and why FPS want to purchase them from the society to take FPS up to the 75% limit. 

You do not have to be Einstein to work out why as the entrenched rights on the A shares are priceless. 

It was stated at the AGM that all DFCSS members will receive an email about what was discussed at the AGM and Q&A parts of the yesterday’s AGM. 

I hope that this allays everyone’s concerns.

Please keep checking the inbox of your computer. 

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13 hours ago, Islaydarkblue said:

 

 

Edited by Cookie

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36 minutes ago, GregTeamDee said:

Ross, why are the numbers so low for DFCSS? 

Personally I think there needs to be a massive overhaul in the way DFCSS operate, from their engagement with the fans to the club, and the club to DFCSS. Something has happened that has result in a massive drop in numbers. The papers reported that the membership is around 400, I was shocked that it was so low.  DFCSS can have a role to play in the club, but I feel its lost its way for a while. 

I've never was or have been a fan of complete fan ownership but I do think my view has been tarnished by the way our society acted in the past. Since last week, I haven't heard of anything the society has done or is doing for the community or the club, in my view it's lost its way. 

We will never agree on everything

Hi Greg,

In my opinion the reason that the membership is so low is because people who are historical members wrongly assume that they are members of DFCSS and are entitled to attend the AGM. 

I assumed that I was able to attend the AGM held in 2017 but sadly as a historical member that was not the case. It is only members who pay their £5 annual DFCSS subscription who are classed as full members and are entitled to join DFCSS as a full member. 

I enclose details of how to join DFCSS from their website http://www.dee4life.com/

Just follow the links and it is easy to complete the application form. I pay my subscription by the Go Cashless scheme and it works no bother. 

As Dayster earlier posted every Dundee supporter must Join the society to protect the rights earned on the shares.

Greg. 

If FPS get their wish and they purchase the A shares there is then nothing to prevent an amalgamation with the Dabs or possibly worse still FPS changing to colour of the Dundee strips to tangerine!

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5 minutes ago, Cookie said:

Why do you have to be so horrible?

I am not being horrible, just stating a fact. I could be a lot worse but civility costs nothing.

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Hi all,

I know this is really contentious stuff but let's just make sure it stays on the topic at hand. We're not there yet but these sorts of threads are really contentious etc and we don't want this to turn toxic and require stuff to be removed etc.

Cheers for your understanding!

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3 hours ago, GregTeamDee said:

This kind of attitude is why fans owned will never work for us, ever. Too many people, with a 'blazer/childish' attitude, 'your not part of the group so I'm not telling you'. When will people realise, we are ALL Dundee fans, whether you live in Dundee, London, New York, Sydney, Wick, wherever! We are all Dundee fans, no one is more important or less important. If you are part of DSA or DFCSS, it doesn't matter one little bit.  We have all equally saved our club twice, we have all put money into the club through various means, writing cheques to keep us going, going to home matches (ST or PATG), being a member or non member of one group, attending club events etc... 

I'm glad we never voted to keep us fans owned,  it was never working, we were a laughing stock of a club. Now we are far more professional, yes results are crap this season, but at least we are in the premiership and able to back our manager with funds each season, far better youth development too. Of course mistakes have been made, but there has been far more positives under FPS.

And due to this kind of attitude, I will not renew my membership of DFCSS and I can see why numbers are so low. (I know Islay, isn't speaking on behalf of DFCSS, but why the secrecy of the meeting). 

Hi Greg,

The meeting was for members of DFCSS not a public meeting. 

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3 hours ago, Thegen65 said:

Thank goodness you are still living on Islay.  You have previously posted if you were living in Dundee then you would stand for election to the DFCSS board.

With that type of attitude i sincerely hope you are never voted on to the board if you return to Dundee,   and you wonder why members are dwindling????

 

 

Hi Thegen,

For the record last week I had my second attempt at my prostate operation in the RAH in Paisley and I was discharged from the hospital on Friday morning the day before yesterday’s DFCSS AGM. I travelled back to Dundee for the AGM which yesterday I attended. 

My prostate operation this time was a success. 

I am very sorry I have upset you but last night I was surprised that no one had posted any reply to your original post hence my original comment. 

All DFCSS members will receive an email regarding what was discussed at both the AGM and Q&A in due course. 

In my opinion all Dundee supporters should join DFCSS as soon as possible to ensure that their voice is heard. 

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