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1 hour ago, BCram said:

quite right but the cash is in the bank now which might be the whole point of the exercise?

Yes, getting cash in early (prepaid income) is fine from a cashflow perspective, as long as it isn't then used up too early, which is effectively classic 'living beyond your means' behaviour. 

However, the nature of ST sales allows the FD to forecast with 'more fact than hope' the 12 months ahead, and to then indicate to the Board how far they can go with contractual commitments for players. Given JM's recent recruitment, we look like having fewer players on the books when this season ends, then in any of the other seasons since promotion (I think...no stats to confirm that).

That may be 'good news' in a financial sense, as it means less of JM's budget will already be allocated before he starts signing or loaning in new players. The down side, though, is that it's sounding already like ST sales may be very slow to build up, for all the good reasons posted already.

If JM manages to get the team on a decent run & we go into the split with any kind of points advantage over Hamilton & St.M, sales may pick up...but the 'price freeze' point (2nd April) will be gone. The Super-earlybird deadline will also be gone with 2 post-split games still to be played, so we may be into the Earlybird phase before we know which league we're in.

I guess a fair number of fans will renew their STs irrespective of what happens, but it seems likely a higher number than before are likely to wait a bit longer before deciding, or will become frequent PATG customers. 

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What we need to clear up all of this up, is a video from John Nelms to be put on the official website free to all to explain his theory behind it. There might be a reasonable explanation behind this. 

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12 hours ago, Double Blue said:

Re the comment above re Fans Rep, John Nelms is not interested in speaking to DFCSS never mind the fans rep. He will only speak to Kenny Ross. Not Kenny's fault but the fault of Nelms.

Why is Kenny the Golden Child?

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11 hours ago, GregTeamDee said:

Been thinking a lot about this today; Why don't we do something different with our season tickets. Why don't we offer packages to supporters, something along the lines of; 

 

Option 1 - Basic season ticket for home league games only.

Option 2 - Home league games & Betfred Cup Group stage games, free entry to reserve games. 

Option 3 - Option 1 & 2 PLUS Penman lounge access before games (drinks not included). 

Option 4 - Option 1,2,3 & DeeTV included.  

 

I do option 4. I get my season ticket, spend money at the penman lounge before the games and have DeeTV.  But why don't we offer the packages? Lets start thinking outside the box, rather than putting prices up & getting nothing back.  The club should show they appreciate the support. 

Been done before. Bronze, silver, gold etc. I had a dip into this years ago and consulted with the Hibs marketing guy, a Dee I may add, and he said we were over complicating our packages which I agreed with.  If you offer too many bits and bobs it then costs money to fulfill that. I know this guy and respect his views as a fellow marketeer.

Best to be simple, easy to understand and set a fair price. The clubs message has to be “ we want you, need you, and appreciate your support” so join in . The key to that is engagement, relationships, togetherness, fun, and......value for money.

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15 hours ago, BigG said:

As someone has worked out already, it is a good price if you can buy now or the super early bird. I’m just hoping that we don’t have cash flow issues as I can’t remember STs ever being on sale this early, it’s also a very strange advertising ploy to sell now when you have absolutely no idea what league we will be in.

 

The problem selling STs now is there is no feel good factor at Dens, I can’t remember the last game I went to  with a bit of confidence that we could get a result,  our home record is so bad in the league and cup.

 

It was the same last year I think and I didn't grudge paying it, I was going to be going no matter what league we were in. Its the same this time round, I'll still be going but its looking likely it will be on a PATG basis.

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11 hours ago, Billy Campbell's Ghost said:

Been done before. Bronze, silver, gold etc. I had a dip into this years ago and consulted with the Hibs marketing guy, a Dee I may add, and he said we were over complicating our packages which I agreed with.  If you offer too many bits and bobs it then costs money to fulfill that. I know this guy and respect his views as a fellow marketeer.

Best to be simple, easy to understand and set a fair price. The clubs message has to be “ we want you, need you, and appreciate your support” so join in . The key to that is engagement, relationships, togetherness, fun, and......value for money.

Absolutely. 

I appreciate people are looking to offer ideas that add value, but what I want is a fair price for a ST, and knowledge of the price and with a long enough time scale to be able to budget for it.

I don't want DEETV, Penman lounge stuff etc and think those using these facilities would be surprised by how few folk are bothered by this stuff. Most folk I know go to the game and go home again and watch the highlights on TV later. 

I'd guess that somewhere between 25-50% of the bring a friend vouchers were never used and things like the free pie with a drink etc weren't utilised either. They are, for most of us, false value and the club know it. 

People talk about match day experience and all the rest of it but in reality most people want to go to the game, watch half decent football (I know that's never going to be a guarantee) and see us pick up a few points along the way (obviously not a given either). Hence when the home form is so bad, and has been for so long, folk aren't looking for sweeteners to entice them into buying a ST, what they want is improvement on the park and to feel like they are being treated with respect by those setting the prices etc. Neither of those things seem to be coming our way, so folk are disgruntled and it will, sooner or later (it feels like sooner right now, but it's early days), hit attendance figures.  

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15 minutes ago, barkblue said:

Absolutely. 

I appreciate people are looking to offer ideas that add value, but what I want is a fair price for a ST, and knowledge of the price and with a long enough time scale to be able to budget for it.

I don't want DEETV, Penman lounge stuff etc and think those using these facilities would be surprised by how few folk are bothered by this stuff. Most folk I know go to the game and go home again and watch the highlights on TV later. 

I'd guess that somewhere between 25-50% of the bring a friend vouchers were never used and things like the free pie with a drink etc weren't utilised either. They are, for most of us, false value and the club know it. 

People talk about match day experience and all the rest of it but in reality most people want to go to the game, watch half decent football (I know that's never going to be a guarantee) and see us pick up a few points along the way (obviously not a given either). Hence when the home form is so bad, and has been for so long, folk aren't looking for sweeteners to entice them into buying a ST, what they want is improvement on the park and to feel like they are being treated with respect by those setting the prices etc. Neither of those things seem to be coming our way, so folk are disgruntled and it will, sooner or later (it feels like sooner right now, but it's early days), hit attendance figures.  

I'm quite jealous of when we see other teams who seem to have a simple package and work all summer and make it a big occasion with counters on the website etc.

I don't expect us to sell millions but to have a cliff edge, where the viability massively changes, is utterly ridiculous. Time is a huge asset IMO and something which we can use to our advantage.

If we don't get out of this situation and go down, it's really important we try and revitalise in the summer and a great way to do that would be to have a big push at selling season tickets.

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4 minutes ago, harry94 said:

I'm quite jealous of when we see other teams who seem to have a simple package and work all summer and make it a big occasion with counters on the website etc.

I don't expect us to sell millions but to have a cliff edge, where the viability massively changes, is utterly ridiculous. Time is a huge asset IMO and something which we can use to our advantage.

If we don't get out of this situation and go down, it's really important we try and revitalise in the summer and a great way to do that would be to have a big push at selling season tickets.

I'd really like Nelms to come out and explain (justify) the new package and especially the two week price freeze.

Who do they think that benefits? How do they think it makes people who don't have that money sitting and ready - and who don't want to take out a loan and effectively go into debt for their club - feel about DFC? Do they understand that they are adversely impacting on the relationship between fan and club and ownership? 

How do they come to the full 'no special deal' price? How many tickets are sold at the top price annually, so is it just a 'fear' number? 

What do the board feel the increase is price is justified through? Inflation? Increased entertainment? A bigger playing budget for the manager? Or just because? 

What we get is a video harking back to a certain Argentinian, the V&A etc etc etc. They even managed to scrape a few goals from this season in there too... just. 

Continually pissing off your customer base and ignoring them will only ever end one way and unfortunately, a lot of the fans seem to feel pissed off and pretty much ignored. 

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Will be the lowest season ticket sales in years next season, whatever happens.

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37 minutes ago, barkblue said:

I'd really like Nelms to come out and explain (justify) the new package and especially the two week price freeze.

Who do they think that benefits? How do they think it makes people who don't have that money sitting and ready - and who don't want to take out a loan and effectively go into debt for their club - feel about DFC? Do they understand that they are adversely impacting on the relationship between fan and club and ownership? 

How do they come to the full 'no special deal' price? How many tickets are sold at the top price annually, so is it just a 'fear' number? 

What do the board feel the increase is price is justified through? Inflation? Increased entertainment? A bigger playing budget for the manager? Or just because? 

What we get is a video harking back to a certain Argentinian, the V&A etc etc etc. They even managed to scrape a few goals from this season in there too... just. 

Continually pissing off your customer base and ignoring them will only ever end one way and unfortunately, a lot of the fans seem to feel pissed off and pretty much ignored. 

Yup - 100%, all of it.

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"........Dundee Managing Director John Nelms has admitted Dundee season tickets are going out earlier than expected but Nelms states that season tickets sales have a major impact on the managers budget and Jim McIntyre has already started to make signings and identify targets for next season......"

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8 minutes ago, Dondeh said:

"........Dundee Managing Director John Nelms has admitted Dundee season tickets are going out earlier than expected but Nelms states that season tickets sales have a major impact on the managers budget and Jim McIntyre has already started to make signings and identify targets for next season......"

Aye cheers John, that's a really good insight into why the club want us to buy season tickets. My mind is now blown with this new info.

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2 minutes ago, chomp my root said:

Aye cheers John, that's a really good insight into why the club want us to buy season tickets. My mind is now blown with this new info.

Tim Keyes must be shi**ing himself. If not, the games a bogey.

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Now the dust has settled on Sunday, it has dawned on me that we will be heading in to April at £340 to £385 per home win on this season's season ticket value.

I appreciate that not everyone looks at it like that and a lot of people buy regardless of how many games they can make/wins they see to help the club and fair play to them, but this home record this season mixed with an only marginally better one the previous two seasons will be one of the biggest factors mixed in with the early bird periods (months earlier than usual) on what is almost guaranteed to be another drop in season ticket sales this Spring/Summer and could be a significant drop with relegation.

Winning our remaining home games would go a long way to restoring a bit of a feel good factor (if we can avoid the drop) and help cushion any drop in sales. How do we do that though when we've only won one home game all season and four league games all season going in to the end of March?

You're basically relying on boys who buy regardless, as value for money, there is next to none with our home record and fans are having to pay £340 to £395 or £24 to £30 a game for the privilege.

 

 

Edited by CW 90+3 02/05/16

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Decided to buy mine this morning. Its in the blood. Only get to half the games but I would rather have a club (in a new stadium) than not have a club.

 

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2 hours ago, Billy Campbell's Ghost said:

Decided to buy mine this morning. Its in the blood. Only get to half the games but I would rather have a club (in a new stadium) than not have a club.

 

Great stuff - after the initial shock has worn off seems some folk that can are investing in this great club of ours. 

Edited by DarkBlueKnight

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I've just been looking at the Dundee Stars season ticket prices for next season. They are the lowest funded club in the Elite League and have apologised for an increase in their prices.

Early bird prices (starting 1st April until 31st May) that cover 31 home games, offer a payment scheme that does not add extra costs for the privilege (unlike for DFC).

Fans have the opportunity to purchase the early bird ticket through a payment plan which will consist of an initial deposit followed by six monthly instalments. An adult ticket works out per game at £16 for an adult; £11.30 concession; £8.90 student; and £4.20 child. 

If you were able to buy a DFC early bird in the 2 week period advised an adult ticket per game works out at £17; concession or student at £11.50 and only £1 for a kid (an area where DFC do very well with their pricing). BUT the "true" early bird is £18.50 adult; £13 concession and student. Student prices to watch the Dee are almost 50% higher than the ice hockey. They also do a 10-timer ticket and PATG is £19 adult (no matter the opposition). In general not a huge difference but do DFC look at the competition (alternative entertainment) when setting prices?

 

OUTRIGHT TOTAL

        STANDING ORDER PAYMENT
  TOTAL PAYMENT DEPOSIT

     6 MONTHLY PAYMENTS (COMMENCING 01/05/19)

ADULT

£496.00                                    £76.00         £70.00

CONCESSION

£351.00

£51.00

        £50.00

CHILD

£130.00

£40.00

        £15.00

STUDENT

£276.00

£66.00

        £35.00

FAMILY £975.00 £165.00

       £135.00

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59 minutes ago, Double Blue said:

I've just been looking at the Dundee Stars season ticket prices for next season. They are the lowest funded club in the Elite League and have apologised for an increase in their prices.

Early bird prices (starting 1st April until 31st May) that cover 31 home games, offer a payment scheme that does not add extra costs for the privilege (unlike for DFC).

Fans have the opportunity to purchase the early bird ticket through a payment plan which will consist of an initial deposit followed by six monthly instalments. An adult ticket works out per game at £16 for an adult; £11.30 concession; £8.90 student; and £4.20 child. 

If you were able to buy a DFC early bird in the 2 week period advised an adult ticket per game works out at £17; concession or student at £11.50 and only £1 for a kid (an area where DFC do very well with their pricing). BUT the "true" early bird is £18.50 adult; £13 concession and student. Student prices to watch the Dee are almost 50% higher than the ice hockey. They also do a 10-timer ticket and PATG is £19 adult (no matter the opposition). In general not a huge difference but do DFC look at the competition (alternative entertainment) when setting prices?

 

OUTRIGHT TOTAL

        STANDING ORDER PAYMENT
  TOTAL PAYMENT DEPOSIT

     6 MONTHLY PAYMENTS (COMMENCING 01/05/19)

ADULT

£496.00                                    £76.00         £70.00

CONCESSION

£351.00

£51.00

        £50.00

CHILD

£130.00

£40.00

        £15.00

STUDENT

£276.00

£66.00

        £35.00

FAMILY £975.00 £165.00

       £135.00

Yeah but who wants to watch ice hockey?

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2 minutes ago, Prince Buster said:

Yeah but who wants to watch ice hockey?

Dundee Stars home attendances went up approx 50% over last season. What direction have DFC's attendances gone this season. and what are they likely to do next season?

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2 minutes ago, Double Blue said:

Dundee Stars home attendances went up approx 50% over last season. What direction have DFC's attendances gone this season. and what are they likely to do next season?

Not an answer to the question I asked.

If you were comparing apples with apples you'd have a point however football fans are football fans, not ice hockey fans.

Edited by Prince Buster

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11 minutes ago, sneddee said:

plenty of people watch ice hockey.

...and when the Ice Arena is 'joined up' to the Noo Campy in 2-3 years time, it might even be easier to make the 'conversion' to add Sat evening hockey to our match-day experience.

As long as nobody then suggests we add baseball to the options...the only sport that rivals cricket for sleep-inducing tedium.

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16 minutes ago, sneddee said:

plenty of people watch ice hockey.

I see plenty of fellow Dees at the ice hockey. It is nice to go along to a game and be entertained and see plenty of goals scored by your team.

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49 minutes ago, WoodStein said:

...and when the Ice Arena is 'joined up' to the Noo Campy in 2-3 years time, it might even be easier to make the 'conversion' to add Sat evening hockey to our match-day experience.

As long as nobody then suggests we add baseball to the options...the only sport that rivals cricket for sleep-inducing tedium.

I’ll be in my car trying to ..... oh never mind😀

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1 hour ago, DarkBlueKnight said:

I’ll be in my car trying to ..... oh never mind😀

Now, now....settle down....  :stirthepot:   

I'd imagine, though, that with all the other attractions on-site (football, movies, dinner, ice hockey), the vast crowds from the stadium might leave the car park in stages, over a few hours?  :rolleyes:  

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