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Should Nelms Go If We Go Down?

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He’s in charge of the club, and if words from the inside are true it’s a dictatorship - he makes all the decision.

He’s overseen the Hartley/McCann/McIntyre fiasco, and its fair to say since he’s soley been in charge of our club we’ve got worse every year on the park.

If we get relegated, would it be fair to say the blame ultimately lies with him, and he should be replaced?

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7 minutes ago, Billy Campbell's Ghost said:

By whom?

Pretty sure the CEO/ Managing Director Of Dundee FC would attract some decent candidates.

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In my opinion John Nelms should be put solely in charge of his ‘pet’ project the new stadium development and the club should advertise for a new Chief Executive. There is no point appointing a Managing Director as I understand that there are currently only two or three board meetings held per year. 

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Should never have been appointed, imagine turning up to your job in a foreign country with no idea about "soccer" let alone the Scottish Fitba game and being given the reigns of one of the biggest clubs in that country, it would never happen, right ?

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should be gone regardless. He wont though.

Keyes may see he is part of the problem eventually, but no holding out much hope.

Chris Grayling of Scottish Football

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I suspect in most other businesses he would have been punted long before now. How bomb-proof he is probably depends on the nature of his friendship with Tim Keyes.

The debacle of appointing Jim McIntyre while being ignorant of the massive controversy associated with Billy Dodds should be grounds for dismissal alone. We have no idea how vital Dodds was to the success of that managerial partnership. Remember Alan Kernaghan being "successful" when Billy Reid was working with him but then a huge failure at Dens? The situation with McIntyre reminds me of that. He spent about 5 minutes talking with Jimmy Boyle last night, probably regarding what substitution to make...by the time Nelson was brought on St J had scored a 2nd goal and the game was gone. 

The two most vital decisions Nelms has had to make during his tenure have been two managerial appointments. Neil McCann was, with the exception of his rescue act during the post-split fixtures after we punted Hartley, an unmitigated disaster. McIntyre is looking like another unmitigated disaster. 

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30 minutes ago, GoatLord said:

I suspect in most other businesses he would have been punted long before now. How bomb-proof he is probably depends on the nature of his friendship with Tim Keyes.

The debacle of appointing Jim McIntyre while being ignorant of the massive controversy associated with Billy Dodds should be grounds for dismissal alone. We have no idea how vital Dodds was to the success of that managerial partnership. Remember Alan Kernaghan being "successful" when Billy Reid was working with him but then a huge failure at Dens? The situation with McIntyre reminds me of that. He spent about 5 minutes talking with Jimmy Boyle last night, probably regarding what substitution to make...by the time Nelson was brought on St J had scored a 2nd goal and the game was gone. 

The two most vital decisions Nelms has had to make during his tenure have been two managerial appointments. Neil McCann was, with the exception of his rescue act during the post-split fixtures after we punted Hartley, an unmitigated disaster. McIntyre is looking like another unmitigated disaster. 

Hi Freend...Was that a Freudian-Slip in your opening line ... Should that be ... "Bomber"- Proof?

Agree with your point, Nelms should distance himself from the managerial appointment process.

The other point you made about McIntyre-Dodds may be valid. Did Brian Clough no also fall away

all together when he lost his long-standing football partner (I'm no advocating/suggesting Dodds)

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Keyes will make that decision and not the fans. DeeVinci - Nelms had a trial for East Fife when he was young so I think he did know about "soccer". Personally I don't think he is the man for the job but Keyes will decide.

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Yes he should, but he wont. Keyes/Nelms are partnership.

If either of them had any sort of self awareness around where the future of this club is going (and their own money) then they would show some true leadership and move Nelms into another role and get a director of football in.

Nelms is not only hugely alienating the support with PATG pricing, ST sales and pandering to Celtic - he's got arguably two of his biggest decisions (Recruiting NM and JM) massively wrong and it's looking highly likely we're relegated because of it.

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Yes.

Next question.

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Yes.

He should be left to solely focus on the stadium project and shouldn't be near footballing or ticket pricing decisions as both have been a complete disaster.

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Definitely. At the end of the day he is running the show, he has presided over 3 absolute abominations of seasons and doesn't seem to know what the hell hes doing.

The best decision he has made was to sack Hartley for the run in and McCann got us over the line but since then it has been farce after farce, that doesn't include the shambles that was the summer of 16/17 and nevermind the way the fans have been treated by the club. The man does not have a clue or simply does not care, possibly even both.

He's a good talker and I keep hearing/reading that he is highly thought of in the boardrooms of Scottish football, which is similar to a former director at my company. A nice guy, great speaker and again he was highly thought of as a person but he was useless in the role.

Unfortunately, Nelms will be here as long as Keyes is. Maybe if Keyes wants his best mucker involved he should be moved into a different role and leave the running football side of the club to someone better suited.

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I think Nelms future depends on his position within FPS.

If he’s a director/shareholder then I guess we’re stuck with him until he either appoints a GM or DOF or FPS close the doors.

We go from one false dawn and shambles to another it has to stop or the might not be a team to support.

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1 hour ago, Gedee said:

Hi Freend...Was that a Freudian-Slip in your opening line ... Should that be ... "Bomber"- Proof?

Agree with your point, Nelms should distance himself from the managerial appointment process.

The other point you made about McIntyre-Dodds may be valid. Did Brian Clough no also fall away

all together when he lost his long-standing football partner (I'm no advocating/suggesting Dodds)

Hi Gedee

interesting you mention Bomber....what I feel we need to give ourselves any chance of staying up is Bomber-style motivation for the last hurrah. Saturday and last night the heads went down worryingly. There’s still a flicker of hope as we do create chances but the morale looks rock bottom.

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1 hour ago, Sebastiano Nela said:

Yes he should, but he wont. Keyes/Nelms are partnership.

If either of them had any sort of self awareness around where the future of this club is going (and their own money) then they would show some true leadership and move Nelms into another role and get a director of football in.

Nelms is not only hugely alienating the support with PATG pricing, ST sales and pandering to Celtic - he's got arguably two of his biggest decisions (Recruiting NM and JM) massively wrong and it's looking highly likely we're relegated because of it.

I think this is the only way JN would move away from the football side of his current role. I'd hoped, long before now, TK/JN would have seen the need for JN to focus 100% on the Camperdown development plans & finding funding partners for it, while establishing a DoF role & to advertise the post. 

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8 minutes ago, GoatLord said:

Hi Gedee

interesting you mention Bomber....what I feel we need to give ourselves any chance of staying up is Bomber-style motivation for the last hurrah. Saturday and last night the heads went down worryingly. There’s still a flicker of hope as we do create chances but the morale looks rock bottom.

50k survival bonuses per player

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1 minute ago, WoodStein said:

I think this is the only way JN would move away from the football side of his current role. I'd hoped, long before now, TK/JN would have seen the need for JN to focus 100% on the Camperdown development plans & finding funding partners for it, while establishing a DoF role & to advertise the post. 

I thought the DOF idea was a good one when it appeared to be under serious consideration before McCann got the bullet. I think that sort of arrangement would be even more useful now since Nelms seems to operate completely autonomously and his footballing decisions have been consistently flawed.

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8 minutes ago, GoatLord said:

Hi Gedee

interesting you mention Bomber....what I feel we need to give ourselves any chance of staying up is Bomber-style motivation for the last hurrah. Saturday and last night the heads went down worryingly. There’s still a flicker of hope as we do create chances but the morale looks rock bottom.

For what would possibly be a short term appointment GoatLord...(& to suit this particular situation we are presently in)

I would go along with your thinking above. We need someone dynamic. A tough, hard personality, & with a bit of character.

As said, maybe someone of the "Bomber Mould"...Although beneath his outer venneer, he may well be a sweet softy :wub:

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9 minutes ago, Sebastiano Nela said:

50k survival bonuses per player

 

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1 minute ago, Gedee said:

For what would possibly be a short term appointment GoatLord...(& to suit this particular situation we are presently in)

I would go along with your thinking above. We need someone dynamic. A tough, hard personality, & with a bit of character.

As said, maybe someone of the "Bomber Mould"...Although beneath his outer venneer, he may well be a sweet softy :wub:

Yes, absolutely a short-term appointment. If Neil McCann had ridden off into the sunset after keeping us up after Hartley then he’d still be an absolute legend who enhanced his reputation in short term charge. As it is he’s irrevocably tarnished by the failed mini-Guardiola experiment.

 

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11 minutes ago, Sebastiano Nela said:

50k survival bonuses per player

Hi Seb'...  I am not sure if you are serious, or it is a passing "tongue in cheek" comment.

Sad thing aboot this is, it could well be the incentive needed to make players up their game.

Personally, being of the "Auld School"...I would prefer to gie them a hard kick up their arses.

Whilst reminding them, I am only asking them to do what they were trained for. And paid for.

But I accept, when just about everyone is driven by financial rewards it is unlikely to work.

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This is probably a very controversial post;

I do understand the frustration towards Nelms. Just like any company the CEO/MD is always in the firing line when things aren't going well, Dundee Football Club is no different. However, I do stress that Keyes and Nelms come as a pair. No one has the funds to buy the shares the Keyes family have and if some supporters push too much they could (unlikely) walk away completely and the club would simply close - meaning the fans would kill the club.  

Nelms is no different from our previous MD's in my view. Some things have improved, some things haven't improved under his guidance. We are all angry due to the fact we are staring relegation in the face, Nelms is probably just as upset as you and I.  If we weren't having such a poor season, there would be no topic about Nelms. 

I agree, that we need a senior figure on the board to guide the MD and owner. This senior figure would be an Archie Knox type of figure. Craig Brown was on the Aberdeen board not that long ago and supported their board of directors in their decision making, which seemed to work well.  It should be that senior figures job to find managers and interview them along with Nelms and come up with their preference for the job for Keyes to make his decision. 

I might be wrong, but I do sense that some of the 'dislike' towards Nelms, could be down too that they are no longer in the loop of what is happening at Dens anymore. He has brought in his own staff and does things his way, whether that is right or wrong. Apparently, Nelms is well liked with other football clubs hence his position on the SPFL board, so he can't be all bad. 

We had many owners and directors, from Dixon, Marrs, Fans owned to Calum Melville to name a few. Every fan could find faults in each of these owners/directors. I don't think we as fans will ever be happy whoever owns us. We simply must get behind the team and our club. 

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13 minutes ago, Gedee said:

Hi Seb'...  I am not sure if you are serious, or it is a passing "tongue in cheek" comment.

Sad thing aboot this is, it could well be the incentive needed to make players up their game.

Personally, being of the "Auld School"...I would prefer to gie them a hard kick up their arses.

Whilst reminding them, I am only asking them to do what they were trained for. And paid for.

But I accept, when just about everyone is driven by financial rewards it is unlikely to work.

Was tongue in cheek mate (kinda). However pretty sure we did something similar in Bombers time

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