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Cobra

Ending the Season

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Coronavirus crisis  

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  1. 1. What should happen if games can't be played?

    • Accept all current positions as final
    • Make the season null and void


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Don't think there is any chance season will be declared Null & Void. Probable outcome is to declare season done and promote and relegate accordingly. That leaves us out of the picture because there are no circumstances that I can see where playoffs can be played and short of drawing lots which wont happen we are likely to be in the Championship next season with Hearts. As for League reconstruction I really can't see it happening, the need for 4 Septic/Sevco games being a priority and even if it did happen 14 is likely as far as they would go, so I suppose it is down to our own fault for not being at least second at the break up imo.  I suppose if the lockdown continues until the end of the summer and even with a reduced preseason there may a need for a reduced season next year to get back on track. Maybe then a 16 team League could happen but I doubt it. I would start the new season with an albeit gimmicky League cup (42 League sides +2) where 4 teams play in a group all in one day at one venue, knock out or shortened game mini league set up with the winners and 5 best runners-up i.e. 16 left doing a similar thing a few weeks later to get down to the semis after only two game days (can see problems with crowd segregation though!!).

My thoughts on the matter are that despite hating the DABs with a vengeance I cant get worked up about them winning the League by default being or whatever, being so far ahead, when folk are losing their lives to this hideous virus. Just want it all over and get back to some form of normality family & social wise. If at the end of it Dundee FC still exist then I would be happy enough.

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As much as i detest that lot across the road, to declare the season null and void with no promotion would be absolute madness.

Hence why the beaks running (ruining) our game will probably go for it.

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10 hours ago, WeighorstsWang said:

Exact same boat. It's not so much them going up I just think its exceptionally unfair on Hearts to be relegated. 

Same with Falkirk not getting a chance at the title despite only being one point behind with numerous games left (they have the 'easier' run in, too). 

Not really getting why some people (ex St Mirren chairman for example) have been arguing that this is some sort of conspiracy to save Hearts. Last season, St Mirren were bottom at the same point. 4 points at this stage is absolutely nothing, especially with the way Scottish Football works, I'd also be aggrieved if Inverness were picked for promotion and ourselves and Ayr were disregarded - even solving that could see Dunfermline, Arbroath and Morton arguing that strong finishes would put them in with a shot at making the play-off.

For me, we either void or resume. The alternative to that and winners/relegation being declared is reconsutrction and I really don't see how that works. If we were quite accommodating at the top end and said we'd promote almost everyone in with a shot at top flight football, it then massively fucks the teams left who have lost substantial levels of income, there's no way to do it without some clubs being big losers - we may as well play a 42 team league and then redefine the leagues from there!

I still think this season will resume tbh. European football is just too lucrative to ignore and I think UEFA will push towards finishing this season and then expediting the competition next term. Once that happens, you'd think the big leagues would fall in line and that would give us something to follow.

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5 minutes ago, harry94 said:

Not really getting why some people (ex St Mirren chairman for example) have been arguing that this is some sort of conspiracy to save Hearts. Last season, St Mirren were bottom at the same point. 4 points at this stage is absolutely nothing, especially with the way Scottish Football works, I'd also be aggrieved if Inverness were picked for promotion and ourselves and Ayr were disregarded - even solving that could see Dunfermline, Arbroath and Morton arguing that strong finishes would put them in with a shot at making the play-off.

For me, we either void or resume. The alternative to that and winners/relegation being declared is reconsutrction and I really don't see how that works. If we were quite accommodating at the top end and said we'd promote almost everyone in with a shot at top flight football, it then massively fucks the teams left who have lost substantial levels of income, there's no way to do it without some clubs being big losers - we may as well play a 42 team league and then redefine the leagues from there!

I still think this season will resume tbh. European football is just too lucrative to ignore and I think UEFA will push towards finishing this season and then expediting the competition next term. Once that happens, you'd think the big leagues would fall in line and that would give us something to follow.

I'd rather see us use this as an opportunity to radically change the way our leagues are structured. The current 4 league set up is ridiculous IMO.

I'd actually go ever further and suggest going to summer football  at the same time. If we are going to do something radical, now is the time to do it.

Not that i truly believe any of the above will actually happen.

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Scotland's chief medical officer said that restrictions will remain in place for at the very least three months. That I think means that the earliest we can realistically resume the football season is sometime in July. Any kind of extended lockdown pushes us into August and I just can't see us playing 8, 9, 10 games in August, September and then immediately kicking off another season.

Eventually we're going to have to follow the Belgians and accept this season is done and move on.

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1 hour ago, Cobra said:

Scotland's chief medical officer said that restrictions will remain in place for at the very least three months. That I think means that the earliest we can realistically resume the football season is sometime in July. Any kind of extended lockdown pushes us into August and I just can't see us playing 8, 9, 10 games in August, September and then immediately kicking off another season.

Eventually we're going to have to follow the Belgians and accept this season is done and move on.

If I understand it correctly, the SPFL and Scottish Cup stopped with 10 weeks of competition remaining. Elsewhere, we can maybe push that to 11 weeks given the CL and EL finals were scheduled to be a few days after our end to the season and some matches were missed.

If teams are returning to pre-season training my September, they could have a 3-4 week pre-season (which could be helpful to the authorities in taking a bit of time to stagger the police and emergency services back to normality) and aim to resume competitive fixtures by Saturday 3rd October. That would then give us the opportunity for finishing our domestic set-up and the European competitions by the new year which would ordinarily be around the exact half-way point of our normal season. We could then take another 3-4 week pre-season (we have a winter break and there would be plenty of free midweeks) and then expedite the cup competitions (the league cup group stage could be eliminated or the competition either removed entirely) and just half the league calendar for a one off half season to run us into the summer and back to normal. Financial settlement and rewards taken as some sort of average over the two terms and reduced in gulf between the two divisions to assist with budgeting.

For what it's worth, there's (sort of) a precedent for a Scottish season being suspended in the past - the 1939 season was finished in completion in 1947. I have a wee suspicion that UEFA and the big leagues may well be looking at 2022 World Cup in Qatar and there may well be the suggestion that we should just switch to a summer football calendar for the next few seasons as a trial - they could even use this as an excuse to trial a big European club competition to aid a transition back at some point in the future.

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2 hours ago, harry94 said:

For me, we either void or resume.

For me also it boils down to this 

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I cant see any chance of resuming the season and therefore logically the only conclusion would be to accept all current positions as final, however, I struggle to find when logic was ever applied to do with Scottish Football from the authorities who run our game.  FWIW I couldn't give a sh*t about u'td  , its more important we keep ourselves safe from the virus and come out the other end and eventually get back tae  the fitba.  Keep safe everyone.

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2 hours ago, Sebastiano Nela said:

I'd rather see us use this as an opportunity to radically change the way our leagues are structured. The current 4 league set up is ridiculous IMO.

I'd actually go ever further and suggest going to summer football  at the same time. If we are going to do something radical, now is the time to do it.

Not that i truly believe any of the above will actually happen.

100 percent agree on summer football 

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How can you relegate a team when they haven’t finished bottom....

Will be a ridiculous decision which Hearts will rightly not accept....

Have to finish the season whenever that is or null and void it. Being relegated is bad enough, being relegated when you still have 10 games to play or so is scandalous in my opinion.

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Whilst I heavily favour void or resume( latter seems increasingly unrealistic)  IF they decide to give out prizes now I could just about stomach top up, bottom down.  ( nice double entendres) but would find saving hearts and promoting teams in non automatic promotion places totally unacceptable. 
NB. I wrote the above trying to wipe the fact the Dabs are top from my mind. 

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5 hours ago, troodee1893 said:

Don't think there is any chance season will be declared Null & Void. Probable outcome is to declare season done and promote and relegate accordingly. That leaves us out of the picture because there are no circumstances that I can see where playoffs can be played and short of drawing lots which wont happen we are likely to be in the Championship next season with Hearts. As for League reconstruction I really can't see it happening, the need for 4 Septic/Sevco games being a priority and even if it did happen 14 is likely as far as they would go, so I suppose it is down to our own fault for not being at least second at the break up imo.  I suppose if the lockdown continues until the end of the summer and even with a reduced preseason there may a need for a reduced season next year to get back on track. Maybe then a 16 team League could happen but I doubt it. I would start the new season with an albeit gimmicky League cup (42 League sides +2) where 4 teams play in a group all in one day at one venue, knock out or shortened game mini league set up with the winners and 5 best runners-up i.e. 16 left doing a similar thing a few weeks later to get down to the semis after only two game days (can see problems with crowd segregation though!!).

My thoughts on the matter are that despite hating the DABs with a vengeance I cant get worked up about them winning the League by default being or whatever, being so far ahead, when folk are losing their lives to this hideous virus. Just want it all over and get back to some form of normality family & social wise. If at the end of it Dundee FC still exist then I would be happy enough.

I think if we go down this route then the next season will get held up anyway, because I'd wager Rangers and Hearts would begin separate legal actions and if they are even heading towards looking like they'd be successful then so would teams from leagues below the top flight.

I honestly think we'll have to resume and then take subsequent seasons from there. It really doesn't matter if one season ends one weekend and the next one starts after a 2 week holiday. After all it will be the same for every club. 

That's not coming from any like, or dislike, of any other particular team but more from the practicalities that the potential for weeks and months of further disruption are too great to change teams' fates without an on the park conclusion. It's simply asking for trouble. 

Imagine a scenario where Hearts get relegated. Take the league to court as the new season begins and then we're forced to scrap a season already in progress and reinstate Hearts in the top division again - or the authorities have to compensate them a seven figure fee? And then you just know the league would appeal... 

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5 hours ago, Cobra said:

Scotland's chief medical officer said that restrictions will remain in place for at the very least three months. That I think means that the earliest we can realistically resume the football season is sometime in July. Any kind of extended lockdown pushes us into August and I just can't see us playing 8, 9, 10 games in August, September and then immediately kicking off another season.

Eventually we're going to have to follow the Belgians and accept this season is done and move on.

Whilst she's saying that restrictions will remain in place for the next 3 months I'm not sure that means all of the current restrictions. My work for example has notified us today that 90% of their operations across Europe will resume on the 13th of this month, here in Dundee we're saying that we could open the gates to employees on the 20th. I'm guessing that they're expecting the lockdown restrictions to be relaxed a little.

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1 hour ago, Reverend Lovejoy said:

Whilst she's saying that restrictions will remain in place for the next 3 months I'm sure that means all of the current restrictions. My work for example has notified us today that 90% of their operations across Europe will resume on the 13th of this month, here in Dundee we're saying that we could open the gate to employees on the 20th. I'm guessing that they're expecting the lockdown restrictions to be relaxed a little.

Conversely I've just been on a national conference call for our (global) business (some of which is still open to serve essential custom here and elsewhere) and they appear to be planning for furlough on into next month. I still don't think anyone knows what's happening because nations are all acting with no coherent collective strategy. 

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I don't think we can null and void the season.

The easiest way to do things is to end the season now and go on average points per game, a bit like cricket's duckworth Lewis method. Top 2 (or 4) go up, no relegation and go to 3 leagues. 

The only alternative would be to play the remaining games behind closed doors and stream the games however players would have to be tested to make sure they didn't have covid19.

 

 

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