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The Dark Blues

The Non Existent Play Offs

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See the EFL are to call the season but still hope to save their play offs. In Scotland assuming they call the season in the Premier only automatic promotion and relegation is to go ahead throughout the leagues despite play offs being every bit as much part of the rewards and downside of a full season. ICT, Ayr and us and the various teams in Lge 1 & Lge 2 should be getting together to raise merry hell in this regard as it would only be looking after their own interests as per the teams kicking out re-organisation of the leagues. If nothing else it might trigger some mini parachute type payment to shut them up especially with all the other controversy going around. 

Wonder what would happen if Hearts were to controversially and most unexpectedly manage to avoid relegation through some route through the legal system. Wonder if the DABs would then be suddenly more interested in a 14 team league. They wouldn't be so mouthy about teams changing minds/votes in those circumstances.

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See the EFL are to call the season but still hope to save their play offs. In Scotland assuming they call the season in the Premier only automatic promotion and relegation is to go ahead throughout th

I admit that I am an insufferable optimist when it comes to Dundee. It could easily be that there was in fact no difference at all between what we had on offer in the vote and what Mr. Nelms held out

What kind of lunacy is this BC ???? NO NO NO, you must go on the scraps of info out there or just have a guess and join the dots to whatever your preheld view is. I mean, you've got to have a preheld

17 minutes ago, troodee1893 said:

See the EFL are to call the season but still hope to save their play offs. In Scotland assuming they call the season in the Premier only automatic promotion and relegation is to go ahead throughout the leagues despite play offs being every bit as much part of the rewards and downside of a full season. ICT, Ayr and us and the various teams in Lge 1 & Lge 2 should be getting together to raise merry hell in this regard as it would only be looking after their own interests as per the teams kicking out re-organisation of the leagues. If nothing else it might trigger some mini parachute type payment to shut them up especially with all the other controversy going around. 

Wonder what would happen if Hearts were to controversially and most unexpectedly manage to avoid relegation through some route through the legal system. Wonder if the DABs would then be suddenly more interested in a 14 team league. They wouldn't be so mouthy about teams changing minds/votes in those circumstances.

This is something I'd thought about too, I deluded myself that it was one of the reasons why we'd go to a 14 team SPL next season. If they manage to pull a rabbit out the hat now its going to make it all pretty interesting..... 🍿

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Another reason it was mad to vote yes, to just throw away the slim playoff chances while letting SPL clubs in the bottom 4 off the hook. It's just one big mess. If the top league finished in July playoffs should take place.

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I'd imagine IF Hearts are successful in court it will be financial compensation rather than staying up as anything else would be more than messy.  

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3 hours ago, HK Blues said:

I'd imagine IF Hearts are successful in court it will be financial compensation rather than staying up as anything else would be more than messy.  

Agree but in Scottish Football anything can happen. If Hearts were successful and a club or more than one goes to the wall and the Virus stops the new season starting until much later than hoped then Reconstruction may just may be back on the agenda.

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Not a legal expert, but I’d bet the SPFL have it written in to their constitution that if teams agree, through a vote, that they can end a season after a number of games and the positions teams are in stand, well we’ve had the vote.

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1 hour ago, valleyboy said:

Not a legal expert, but I’d bet the SPFL have it written in to their constitution that if teams agree, through a vote, that they can end a season after a number of games and the positions teams are in stand, well we’ve had the vote.

We've had the vote, positions are indeed as they stand as if the season had been completed but there is no reason why, imo, that play offs could not have at least been considered even behind closed doors. This is no doubt a forlorn hope but as I said in my OP we should be considered for any compensation along with ICT and Ayr and the equivalent clubs in League 1 & 2 for losing out on the chance of promotion. This is especially warranted if Hearts, Partick etc get compensation for their relegations. I don't know if we have brought this up, we may well have done but if we haven't then we should 'grow a pair' and fight tooth and nail for this.

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Livi's statement today is doing more to shine a light on the lack of play-offs than either ourselves, ICT or Ayr are. They have said it's "simply unbelievable" that clubs are being denied their rightful shot at promotion and others are being relegated. 

We've invested a lot of money to put ourselves in a position to have a shot at promotion, so to have that opportunity taken away from us with no recompense of any sort is scandalous, and I don't know why we're not shouting this from the rooftops and taking it up with the SPFL. Shouldn't take a club like Livi, who are set to finish 5th in the top flight and aren't affected by these issues, to highlight them.

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1 hour ago, Ricky Spanish said:

Livi's statement today is doing more to shine a light on the lack of play-offs than either ourselves, ICT or Ayr are. They have said it's "simply unbelievable" that clubs are being denied their rightful shot at promotion and others are being relegated. 

We've invested a lot of money to put ourselves in a position to have a shot at promotion, so to have that opportunity taken away from us with no recompense of any sort is scandalous, and I don't know why we're not shouting this from the rooftops and taking it up with the SPFL. Shouldn't take a club like Livi, who are set to finish 5th in the top flight and aren't affected by these issues, to highlight them.

I said that all along no reason why the playoffs can’t take place, I was hoping that’s what Nelms was trying to negotiate when in talks with Doncaster But obviously not opportunity missed imo 

 

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6 hours ago, valleyboy said:

Not a legal expert, but I’d bet the SPFL have it written in to their constitution that if teams agree, through a vote, that they can end a season after a number of games and the positions teams are in stand, well we’ve had the vote.

You lose that bet

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2 hours ago, gblue said:

I said that all along no reason why the playoffs can’t take place, I was hoping that’s what Nelms was trying to negotiate when in talks with Doncaster But obviously not opportunity missed imo 

 

John Nelms as far as we know negotiated absolutely nothing, Reconstruction was already on the table as we’ve already heard , no fairness for the relegated clubs during an incomplete season . No compensation for play off clubs , no compensation for relegated clubs .

Absolutely clueless and you’re right it was a missed opportunity to change things in the SPFL for the better .

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1 hour ago, Dcsarmy said:

John Nelms as far as we know negotiated absolutely nothing, Reconstruction was already on the table as we’ve already heard , no fairness for the relegated clubs during an incomplete season . No compensation for play off clubs , no compensation for relegated clubs .

Absolutely clueless and you’re right it was a missed opportunity to change things in the SPFL for the better .

Sorry Dcsarmy. Absolutely nobody was talking about this episode ending up with reconstruction. There was nobody who thought and I stress the word thought, that any of the outcomes you mentioned was going to happen.

Hoping was the best that anyone suggested and they were outnumbered by those who correctly said nothing would happen.0₩

Blaming John Nelms is IMO unfair. He does appear to have achieved nothing but the fat lady has not sung yet so let's wait and see what happens.

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2 minutes ago, BCram said:

Sorry Dcsarmy. Absolutely nobody was talking about this episode ending up with reconstruction. There was nobody who thought and I stress the word thought, that any of the outcomes you mentioned was going to happen.

Hoping was the best that anyone suggested and they were outnumbered by those who correctly said nothing would happen.0₩

Blaming John Nelms is IMO unfair. He does appear to have achieved nothing but the fat lady has not sung yet so let's wait and see what happens.

Is it really unfair, JN had the power for 72 hours, he had the casting vote to actually instigate meaningful change and we all thought because of the official statements he would have voted No . 

The resolution was passed which as Allan Maitland of Hamilton said reconstruction talks were already part of it .

Since then we’ve Livingston trying to push forward compensation for the teams adversely affected by an incomplete season.

So I’m not really sure what JN actually achieved by doing the U turn , it adversely hurt our Club re play offs and a chance of promotion and also the financial side as well .

Unfair criticism, I’m not so sure 

 

 

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30 minutes ago, Dcsarmy said:

Is it really unfair, JN had the power for 72 hours, he had the casting vote to actually instigate meaningful change and we all thought because of the official statements he would have voted No . 

The resolution was passed which as Allan Maitland of Hamilton said reconstruction talks were already part of it .

Since then we’ve Livingston trying to push forward compensation for the teams adversely affected by an incomplete season.

So I’m not really sure what JN actually achieved by doing the U turn , it adversely hurt our Club re play offs and a chance of promotion and also the financial side as well .

Unfair criticism, I’m not so sure 

 

 

I imagine he's strengthened his relationships with the SPFL and Celtic. Whether that has any benefits for him and us in the future remains to be seen.

It's possible that Nelms has been offered sweeteners that are still unknown, e.g. a place on the SPFL board, first dibs on a promising loan player like Karamoko Dembele. Who knows?

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54 minutes ago, BCram said:

Sorry Dcsarmy. Absolutely nobody was talking about this episode ending up with reconstruction. There was nobody who thought and I stress the word thought, that any of the outcomes you mentioned was going to happen.

Hoping was the best that anyone suggested and they were outnumbered by those who correctly said nothing would happen.0₩

Blaming John Nelms is IMO unfair. He does appear to have achieved nothing but the fat lady has not sung yet so let's wait and see what happens.

Sorry but this is semantics, nobody thought but they were hoping? Playing with words

So do you think or hope that the fat lady will sing?

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