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Realistically How Long Can We Hold On to Paul Hartley ?


gedee

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Managers come and managers go.

But in PH we might just have somebody that really is little bit special  :) 

If that proves to be the the case, other Clubs will be knockng on the door at Dens pulling out their cheque books to get a hold of him.

In his recent interview .... "Keyes noted that “eight, nine, ten scouts†were sitting behind him at the derby, likely interested in star performers Greg Stewart and Bain, among others"   

Adding ... "Obviously the better we play, the more they will be looking at our players,â€

Keyes said, content to accept "this has to be the modus operandi for clubs"      (I don't disagree with that)

We are never going to be a Club, like say Celtic, with a huge regular growing support that will allow us to spend a million on a player.

But in PH, it seems we do have a manager that appears to be willing to work himself into the ground.

And part of his time seems to be successfully unearthing talented players, at very little financial expense to the Club.

We would all agree, not every potential "star" has went on to be a winner.

But he has proved he can work within the confines of a very limited budget ...... and when one of these little known, unheard of players, hits the mark .... well just how good it that for DFC's future finances.   

(Keyes must be very much aware of the worth of PH)  And in his recent interview he has again confirmed, it's about long term.

Personally I would put the value of  a hard working, proven manager, who had the ability to spot potential young, unknown talent, far away ahead of any overpriced player, which stretched the club's budget to breaking point, and then possibly proved to be a disaster.  

I hope those at DFC feel the same....... and see Paul Hartley as part of that long term investment

And if PH turns out to be the force we hope he is, he does all he can (in financial terms) to hold on to him.

Money comes into everything these days. In this case however, I think it would simply be a reflection of how much DFC valued PH.

As well as of course simple economics .....holding on to someone who had the ability to make money for the Club.

And learned how to be happy and smile (at last) during post match interviews :)  

DFC .... Invest in PH. Like yourselves, he kens noo, he's now a DFC man :)

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I do worry about how we react, if and when we lose one of our key players or our Boss to another club. We have always been a selling team, through necessity, and whilst the need to sell may be less at this moment, it still exists. For me, key factors are 1) How much dosh we get 2) Who they are going to and 3) The timing. Hope we are past the days when we lost the likes of Billy Dodds to the penny daintees for not much more than a penny dainty!

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When Cardiff came calling he decided to stay, for me that speaks volumes of the man. He knows he still has a lot to learn and would probably only go for the right club / project. 

I have a feeling that he won't be tempted away until he has achieved something in the Premiership, ie getting us to a European Qualification spot / win a major cup. 

He seems to understand he is a young manager and still has learning to do, which of course he be able to do with Dundee. I love the work ethic and enthusiasm. It really rubs off on the players when you see him at the edge of his technical area ensuring they are pressing and harassing our opposition. 

If however, he did decide to move on then the club must react appropriately and choose a manager who is just as hard working and enthusiastic about working at Dens. As for players, they will come and go and I pray that we do a Hibs and reject point blank to sell to our rivals, albeit ours are in the Premiership. Would love a blanket no Old Firm policy but money talks. On the flipside of that though, if the player is good enough there will be clubs outside of Scotland coming for him. 

As for the club, please don't accept the first stinking offer and make the pursuers sweat a bit and hold out for our valuation, it works at the Brick. Then at least a significant portion of that to be reinvested in the squad / club. I don't think we are asking for much.

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Really all depend on how we do til end of season

if we go on to loose next 10 games why would anyone worry what happens to him.

If we go on a winning streak , or finbish well in league or win cup then there can be talk of him leaving for a higher club,

Believe it or no - PH would have been under some stick (not from me) had we lost that derby to a very very poor DAB side , alot of fans round me where getting ratty with PH and some of the players so i wouldnt say everyone is 100% sweat on him just yet.

He`s lucky in the same way Ivano was in that he`s got a class song about him which helps the manager

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I hear  both yourself HK Blues and yourself BCram......And I kinda apologise for meh overlong opening post and not making my point clear.

I honestly accept that Dundee FC will remain a Selling Club.   However, what I was trying to emphasise, was mainly the economic position.

Having a manager who improves the team. Also makes the Club money, by signing players at low cost, which they can  sell on at big profit.

Or a new manager who is less successful with that system. Asks the Club for an increased budget. Maybe disnae work, and we lose money.

Americans appear to be astute Business men. I am wondering if it would make more financial sense to pay PH the big bucks to retain him.

I could understand (maybe even more so for someone like PH) wanting to stretch himself, to prove to himself, he has the ability to step up.

But if through the money saved/made, continuing the policy of the buying of low cost and selling on as high priced players, would not trying

to hold on to PH be a better use of the Club's Finances.  So that's it now awe settled PH. Jist bide wi DFC until we win the Premiership :)

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I key thing is finding quality in a manager and players when inevitably they move on.

As an Arab detester, I still recognise how well they have replaced the players that they have sold.

The current lot are maybe not as good as in the past, however they are still a decent side, despite filling Celtics ranks with their three best players.

The worry is that our scouting system is still not good enough to let us do that.

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He seems like a man with a plan, don't think it's a coincidence he started where he did with Alloa and I think he's set on winning us a up and hoping for a good English project in higher reached of Championship or EPL.  Can't see him leaving to another Scottish club with the exception of Celtic and even then think he's set on winning us something first.

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I key thing is finding quality in a manager and players when inevitably they move on.

As an Arab detester, I still recognise how well they have replaced the players that they have sold.

The current lot are maybe not as good as in the past, however they are still a decent side, despite filling Celtics ranks with their three best players.

The worry is that our scouting system is still not good enough to let us do that.

Reasonable point of view Spirit. The point was made on the Stevie Campbell thread that perhaps the scouting side is the key. Garbage in Garbage out, you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, etc etc.

Maybe finding young players with potential and talent is more important than running an academy well. Hartley seems to have an eye for a player, but getting them to come to Dens is based on his reputation as a good manager and the reputation of our club as being well managed. The wages we pay must play a big part, but if we could demonstrate that playing for the Dee's and being part of a winning team was a stepping stone to better paid teams then things would be much easier.

Paradoxically the disaster that was Utd selling their three top players to Celtic might just encourage likewise ambitious players and THEIR AGENTS, to go to Utd because of their willingness to make money rather than hold on to their players to achieve success.

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I think he's more passionate about the job at Dundee than when he turned down Cardiff. He's cleared out a lot of players and built his own squad at Dens, he's re-energised a famous old club and he commands enormous respect at the club among the board, players and fans. Walking away now makes no sense.

I'm convinced he'll have a real go at getting us to Hampden and into Europe and then re-assess things in the summer. Until then I'm happy to enjoy the ride without worrying about managerial changes.

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What we need for DFC to be successful is ....  (imo)

A good manager.

A developing youth system

And a nationwide, quality, scouting network.

I believe, given time, we will be successful in all three areas.

But meanwhile, it could be said, we are just about there with the first one.

Focusing on that. I hope Keyes and Nelms give PH a clear message, his future is here at Dens

Paul Hartley, is hard working and ambitious. Offer him Top Dollar to be involved in.......All three aspects of DFC's future.

That is how I feel anyway. (and that assumes his progress continues)  If this means a huge salary for PH, at least we know he will be earning it

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I think he's more passionate about the job at Dundee than when he turned down Cardiff. He's cleared out a lot of players and built his own squad at Dens, he's re-energised a famous old club and he commands enormous respect at the club among the board, players and fans. Walking away now makes no sense.

I'm convinced he'll have a real go at getting us to Hampden and into Europe and then re-assess things in the summer. Until then I'm happy to enjoy the ride without worrying about managerial changes.

Yes, I agree, I think he will want to win something. He will be here for another season at least.

We have got to accept we are a selling club but hopefully when a team comes together we will win something, before it's broken up. Also, we need to have an astute board which is good at replacing management talent too...

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