Baraclough V Hartley...

[Count Duckula]

Last 20 games - PH W4 D5 L11, IB W5 D4 L11

Does the fact that PH is not under pressure mean that we are in a much more stable position than we have been for years and the owners are taking a more long term view rather than the usual knee-jerk reactions we have been used too.

Or does it mean PH will have to start producing results sooner rather than later to stop the natives becoming restless 👿

Edited 24 September 2015 by Count Duckula

[CW 90+3 02/05/16]

PH W4 D5 L11, IB W5 D4 L11

Does the fact that PH is not under pressure mean that we are in a much more stable position than we have been for years and the owners are taking a more long term view rather than the usual knee-jerk reactions we have been used too.

Or does it mean PH will have to start producing results sooner rather than later to stop the natives becoming restless

Both.

Baraclough shouldn't have been sacked IMO but Hartley is going to have to seriously start improving on a record that has been poor since the derby win at Dens back in early April.

[Ivan Drago]

I think it's a mixture of both.

The Yanks are clearly very supportive of Hartley which is a good thing IMO. However I have never known another Dee manager to be given such an easy ride from the support. we must all be mellowing in our old age....well some of us! :-)

[Cobra]

The decision to sack Baraclough was laughable.

As for Hartley's record, I don't really care about results in the dead rubbers after the split last season. They're not of any great significance right now.

We're currently top six, which is great but Celtic and Dunfermline were not great moments for the manager.

[TheDarkBlues]

The decision to sack Baraclough was laughable.

As for Hartley's record, I don't really care about results in the dead rubbers after the split last season. They're not of any great significance right now.

We're currently top six, which is great but Celtic and Dunfermline were not great moments for the manager.

In all honesty, you could add last seasons results against the Arabs, and the 3-1 loss to St Mirren. If this was the BOD of old, PH may/possibly/could have been gone by now and this makes me wonder if the BOD are more happy with things off the pitch more than on it, in so much that his attitude and work rate is much more professional than a lot of managers we have had over the years.

Maybe it is good that we have a less trigger happy Texan on our board!

[bjs]

Not sure on the comparison. Baraclough kept well in the top flight by the skin of his teeth, Hartley achieved our highest finish in years. Well are sitting near the bottom of the league again this season while we are again sitting in the top 6. Granted we have had some poor performances but we've also had some  good performances also which see's most of us thinking we can or will finish between 4th & 8th. Motherwell on the other had are looking at 11th-8th and would bite your hand off to be where we are.

On another note, I think they were premature in getting rid of the boy, but it had been rumored that he wasnt getting the best out of the squad and perhaps some werent applying themselves as good as they could have, so maybe they had no choice.

[Edin_Dee]

Couldn't quite believe it when I heard that Baraclough had been sacked but the suggestion is that he had completely lost the dressing room. No way back when that happens usually especially when he has had time to bring in his own players. Having said that up until yesterday I didn't really consider that they would be relegated. Now I think they are really contenders. No manager should ever be sacked before Christmas IMO.

Hartley got us top 6 last season so it was job well done. It was poor form after the split but those stats shouldn't be included with this seasons. Celtic performance and Dunfermline result aside it has been a solid start. A win on Saturday could put us joint 4th which would turn it into an excellent start. Can't compare the two managers.  

[Attilio]

The decision to sack Baraclough was laughable.

As for Hartley's record, I don't really care about results in the dead rubbers after the split last season. They're not of any great significance right now.

We're currently top six, which is great but Celtic and Dunfermline were not great moments for the manager.

Just about sums it up Cobra.  If we were sitting in Utds position and had just been punted 6-0 by Celtic, I imagine the peg might be a bit more shoogly.  Thankfully, we have more astute folk running the club at this moment.  Top 6 last season and looking like Top 6 this season.  We could only have dreamt of this three or so years back.

[Deefiant]

Last 20 games - PH W4 D5 L11, IB W5 D4 L11

Does the fact that PH is not under pressure mean that we are in a much more stable position than we have been for years and the owners are taking a more long term view rather than the usual knee-jerk reactions we have been used too.

Or does it mean PH will have to start producing results sooner rather than later to stop the natives becoming restless

20 games is too far back - you are then including Motherwells playoff against championship dross Rangers, and 5 games against bottom 6 clubs while Hartley competed with the top 6 teams who, quite frankly, were all way ahead of us last season. We also had a tricky run leading into the split with Aberdeen, Celtic, Utd and St. Johnstone. Look at this seasons results and compare for an even playing field.

Hartley gave us our best finish in years last season, top 6 from a newly promoted club has only been done twice since the split was introduced and is a very good achievement. So far this season he is a point ahead of last season with a not too unfavorable run of games coming up.

We are far from the finished article but we are again solid and unspectacular - clearly better than Kilmarnock, Thistle, Motherwell but clearly behind Celtic & Aberdeen. We are operating at a similar level to the rest and therefore we could just as easily finish 3rd as 8th - we will be hoping to be nearer the top end but the goals are top 6 first and survival 2nd. Lot of delusions of grandeur creeping in to our support after 1 solid but unspectacular season IMO.

[Cobra]

No club should ever sack their manager immediately after a disappointing cup result. To me it smacks of a short-sighted owner exercising power because he can. We did it with Duffy and it took years to recover.

 

If Morton can win at Parkhead after extra time it's no great surprise that they can do it at home to Motherwell.

 

Hartley's got it badly wrong over 90 minutes numerous times but if you're looking at the bigger picture he's doing a good job. Knee-jerks reactions to bad results need to stay in the past and at Fir Park.

[Boba Fett]

20 games is too far back - you are then including Motherwells playoff against championship dross Rangers, and 5 games against bottom 6 clubs while Hartley competed with the top 6 teams who, quite frankly, were all way ahead of us last season. We also had a tricky run leading into the split with Aberdeen, Celtic, Utd and St. Johnstone. Look at this seasons results and compare for an even playing field.

Hartley gave us our best finish in years last season, top 6 from a newly promoted club has only been done twice since the split was introduced and is a very good achievement. So far this season he is a point ahead of last season with a not too unfavorable run of games coming up.

We are far from the finished article but we are again solid and unspectacular - clearly better than Kilmarnock, Thistle, Motherwell but clearly behind Celtic & Aberdeen. We are operating at a similar level to the rest and therefore we could just as easily finish 3rd as 8th - we will be hoping to be nearer the top end but the goals are top 6 first and survival 2nd. Lot of delusions of grandeur creeping in to our support after 1 solid but unspectacular season IMO.

No club should ever sack their manager immediately after a disappointing cup result. To me it smacks of a short-sighted owner exercising power because he can. We did it with Duffy and it took years to recover.

 

If Morton can win at Parkhead after extra time it's no great surprise that they can do it at home to Motherwell.

 

Hartley's got it badly wrong over 90 minutes numerous times but if you're looking at the bigger picture he's doing a good job. Knee-jerks reactions to bad results need to stay in the past and at Fir Park.

I concur.. 

[Ivan Drago]

No club should ever sack their manager immediately after a disappointing cup result. To me it smacks of a short-sighted owner exercising power because he can. We did it with Duffy and it took years to recover.

If Morton can win at Parkhead after extra time it's no great surprise that they can do it at home to Motherwell.

Hartley's got it badly wrong over 90 minutes numerous times but if you're looking at the bigger picture he's doing a good job. Knee-jerks reactions to bad results need to stay in the past and at Fir Park.

Don't think it's as simplistic as that Cobra.

There may be things going on off the park etc that make the board realise he's not the man to take them forward. Sticking with a manager if he's the wrong man is more damaging than a short termist approach IMO.

For example some folk were saying Levien and Burley needed time, no they didn't they were just stinking appointments.