Is Our Game (Football And Footballers) Getting Too Soft ?

[Gedee]

I have just started a New Topic a few moments ago (RUGBY) where I have kinda already touched on this.

However this, although similar, refers to players falling down and rolling aroung the grass, pained expressions, face twisted in mortal agony.

And yet it is obvious to everybody and anybody watching ........ they have been barely touched.

During the womens football of a few months ago (and I know that is not for everyone) no only was there some great pices o' skill shown (imo) there was also some "real beefy tackles"  

In the main, most recipients of these heavy tackles, did not make an issue of this ..... just seem to accept this, as being part of the game .....and getting up, and getting on with it.

Made me think (and this is my question)..... If there was a game between a team of women against a team of men, and the women managed to put in a few hefty tackles into the men, do you think even ONE MAN would go through the rolling aroond in agony actin front of them and the watching fans ?

Or wid that be jist a wee bt "too girly" for him" to act that way.... after a girl grounded him wi' a tackle ?

( Methinks) .....Even if his leg wis hinging aff, he wid be "far too manly" tae show, and admit "this lassie really hurted me"

[JoeCovenant]

No.

It's getting too sleekit.

Diving, over-reaction, and outright lying by players.

(Falling down holding their face)

Add into that 'cynical' fouling (which is bad enough, but when we're talking "take him out the game" fouls, that's something else altogether)

In a nutshell - the game hasn't been taken over by softies, it's been taken over by cheats.

[Canberra]

Great topic , how about the commentators

"That was a foul that had to be made"

How often do you hear that comment , far too often for my liking , it's condoning a player cheating in my opinion.

Wasn't it the Spurs player just a few weeks ago who got sent off against Arsenal , the comment was "he took one for the team (red card) to stop a goal being scored"

[BCram]

Agree Canberra. Only way to stop it would be if the words "professional foul" were changed to disgraceful foul, player should be sent off. Seems odd that the risk of losing a goal is justification for making a foul. I would hope that the certainty of losing a player would quickly stop it.

[Gedee]

Thanks for all your responses and helping to get this topic off the ground.

"Sleekit" .... "Cheating" ... "Encouragement for fouling from commentators" .... "words like "professional foul" ...... are (imo) all relelevant points made by the posters and I would like to see this theme developed on this topic. But I still think it is ridiculous that these professional men have to carry this "play-acting carry on", on the pitch when they have been barely touched !!  Or, to give them the benefit of the doubt have only received a very minor injury. But that my result in free kick, penalty, sending off, trainer on,and "injured" player going off the field for "treatment"etc......then the farting aboot, while the same player tries tae get on the park again.

If I can put this another way ....

Would the same men players in a team who did the pained rolling act say 20 times in a game against another team of men, EVER even consider it, if playing a team of women and of course the same  tackle wis made by a girl/woman ? ..... I think not !! .... So somebody is kidding somebody here

[BCram]

Spot on Gedee. We all accept the need to claim for fouls, etc, it's the biggest shout of the day sometimes. You just never hear a rugby crowd appealing for action from the referee unless it is an obvious punch, or stamp or a "clothes line" tackle. There is a massive difference in the crowd's involvement as a result of this. At rugby matches you watch the play and encourage your team. At football you referee the game and shout out your decisions to the ref. That's probably a major oversimplification but you get the idea. I should add that nobody really sees what the referee sees at a rugby match. he's much closer to a much slower moving contact sport and as a result the crowd only ever gets involved with the referee when there is a blatant and obvious act of foul play.

I'm sure you will remember dashing down the wing past an opponent who just misses you with his tackle and perhaps ever so slightly clips your ankle. Despite your best efforts to carry on, you fall down, a couple of strides after the contact. A dive or a foul, how does the ref know. If you are playing for the Dee's against Celtic at Celtic Park you get booked for a dive.If you are playing at Dens against the same Celtic team you get awarded a foul and the Celtic player gets booed every time he touches the ball!

Edited 2 October 2015 by BCram

[Gedee]

Spot on Gedee. We all accept the need to claim for fouls, etc, it's the biggest shout of the day sometimes. You just never hear a rugby crowd appealing for action from the referee unless it is an obvious punch, or stamp or a "clothes line" tackle. There is a massive difference in the crowd's involvement as a result of this. At rugby matches you watch the play and encourage your team. At football you referee the game and shout out your decisions to the ref. That's probably a major oversimplification but you get the idea. I should add that nobody really sees what the referee sees at a rugby match. he's much closer to a much slower moving contact sport and as a result the crowd only ever gets involved with the referee when there is a blatant and obvious act of foul play.

I'm sure you will remember dashing down the wing past an opponent who just misses you with his tackle and perhaps ever so slightly clips your ankle. Despite your best efforts to carry on, you fall down, a couple of strides after the contact. A dive or a foul, how does the ref know. If you are playing for the Dee's against Celtic at Celtic Park you get booked for a dive.If you are playing at Dens against the same Celtic team you get awarded a foul and the Celtic player gets booed every time he touches the ball!

Good Stuff there BCram .... (And I am going off topic here myself) 

But as you seem to know quite a bit about Rugby as well as Football (this should be on my rugby topic)  How come the opposing fans/supporters at the International Rugby Games, can not only stand together, but at the same time happily enjoy a pint together (or have I got that wrong?)  Are fitba fans no tae be trusted like?

[Boba Fett]

Great topic , how about the commentators

"That was a foul that had to be made"

How often do you hear that comment , far too often for my liking , it's condoning a player cheating in my opinion.

Wasn't it the Spurs player just a few weeks ago who got sent off against Arsenal , the comment was "he took one for the team (red card) to stop a goal being scored"

Agreed.. "He had every right to go down there" is another that grinds my gears.

Its a debate that's already been had but if there's no contact and a player goes down, It's cheating in my book.

[BCram]

Apologies Gedee.I got confused. You are right about the rugby fans happily mixing together. There isn't much banter. It's more about supporting your team and not about rubbishing the opposition. Because you could do real and permanent damage with blatant foul play and it was an amateur game, even at international level until the 1970's, rugby players were much more "law" abiding. It was largely self policing. You punched someone they punched you back and it sorted out amongst the players. there was no thought of being a clype and telling the referee that " a big  laddie hit me!" It was such a minority sport that almost everyone, except the women, who went along to watch, had played the game. You watched the players and understood the difficulty of the tackle, the bravery needed etc. There's the same understanding of football, you just need to read many of the posts on here, but the culture isn't the same. Players make a mistake and they get pilloried by the opposition fans, and it just builds from there IMO.

Football fans have histories of rivalries for decades and it is part of the passion for football.

[Gedee]

Apologies Gedee.I got confused. You are right about the rugby fans happily mixing together. There isn't much banter. It's more about supporting your team and not about rubbishing the opposition. Because you could do real and permanent damage with blatant foul play and it was an amateur game, even at international level until the 1970's, rugby players were much more "law" abiding. It was largely self policing. You punched someone they punched you back and it sorted out amongst the players. there was no thought of being a clype and telling the referee that " a big  laddie hit me!" It was such a minority sport that almost everyone, except the women, who went along to watch, had played the game. You watched the players and understood the difficulty of the tackle, the bravery needed etc. There's the same understanding of football, you just need to read many of the posts on here, but the culture isn't the same. Players make a mistake and they get pilloried by the opposition fans, and it just builds from there IMO.

Football fans have histories of rivalries for decades and it is part of the passion for football.

Another fine interesting  post BCram ..... it's good tae see your good self swinging along on the forum

(Dinnae worry aboot maybe yir post going intae the wrang Topic Heading .....I dinnae think I am quite sure what I am daeing today)

As you might be able to see I have had to press the "edit button" .....

MY POST VANISHED THERE IN MID-STRIDE. MAYBE I PRESSED THE WRONG BUTTON ON THE KEYBOARD ....it has happened before, and I have lost a post. Or again there may be some cunning plans going on behind the scenes, that I dinnae ken aboot (a wee sleekit reminder I am posting too much keech today !! )    I hae a few days like that ..... but it helps keep the forum busy   

I wonder if on a general level .... The interest in Professional Football is diminishing. Driven with too much money maybe ....Well certainly in England's Premier Division. While the interest in Rugby is on the up for the opposite reasons.....could be wrong ?

[chomp my root]

Apologies Gedee.I got confused. You are right about the rugby fans happily mixing together. There isn't much banter. It's more about supporting your team and not about rubbishing the opposition. Because you could do real and permanent damage with blatant foul play and it was an amateur game, even at international level until the 1970's, rugby players were much more "law" abiding. It was largely self policing. You punched someone they punched you back and it sorted out amongst the players. there was no thought of being a clype and telling the referee that " a big  laddie hit me!" It was such a minority sport that almost everyone, except the women, who went along to watch, had played the game. You watched the players and understood the difficulty of the tackle, the bravery needed etc. There's the same understanding of football, you just need to read many of the posts on here, but the culture isn't the same. Players make a mistake and they get pilloried by the opposition fans, and it just builds from there IMO.

Football fans have histories of rivalries for decades and it is part of the passion for football.

I used to think football matches would be better if the fans were mixed but I think part of the 'charm' (maybe not exactly the right word) of football crowds is the togetherness of having home and away ends. Having been to football matches where they've not bothered to segregate, it can make for a quieter atmosphere. As you say, the vibe at football is a different one to going to rugby matches, I'd love it if some of the good natured side of rugby crowds could somehow be brought across to the football but I can't see it, I think the culture of negativity at football is deeply ingrained.